Redeeming the Time - One hole or two? Follow-up

First-off, if anywhere in this I contradict myself, or say something that isn't true, or anything that you thing I need to be corrected on, please let me know. I tried to take the Bible verses in their contexts and tried to read what the underlying text says, and I tried to be humble and kind in how I read other people's responses. Thank you for being humble and kind in yours!

Here goes:

Alexandria S - me

Modesty is not to give guidelines on what women should wear. – 1 Tim 2:9 specifically refers to women adorning themselves in modest apparel. This seems to say that there is such a thing as modest apparel, and such a thing as immodest apparel.

Modesty is a reflection of Christ. – Agree.

Our goal is simply holiness. – Agree. However, sanctification covers ever area of our lives and we must check ourselves in all these areas to see, “Am I being Biblical here? Does the Bible have something to say about this, directly or indirectly?” Though be careful about reading between the lines or pulling meanings out of passages that were never there.

The Bible does not say women have to wear skirts. – Agree. In fact, when skirt is used in the Bible, it not quite the same as the modern usage of the word.

We should honor Christ in all we do. – Agree.

Abby H - me

Modesty is saving yourself. – (I’m a bit confused here?) Spiritual salvation is not by works but by faith alone.

Wear what makes you comfortable but be smart. – Within Biblical boundaries. And yes, don’t be dumb in your clothing choices.

Our body is the temple of the Lord. – Agree; our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor 6:19).

Natalie L - me

If dress distracts us or others from the Lord it’s not a good thing. – Agree.

Talk to your parents about it. – Agree. Children, obey your parents in the Lord. <- Don’t leave out that last part!

As you grow in faith and mature you will better understand modesty. – Pray for wisdom and the fear of the Lord to make godly choices.

Charis B - me

Your body is God’s temple. – Agree.

You do not show off your body. – Agree.

God calls us to dress modestly. – Agree.

What a Christian wears is their choice. – Yes, but is your choice God’s choice?

Olivia - me

I don't get the styles that are going around - I don't either. But some women like to dress to attract guys, and it works. Sadly.

Okay, my thoughts for Kinzie’s response will take a little while. Not only because she contributed OVER HALF of the word count, but because I would like to say a few more things.

100% positive, nobody on here believes what I believe. – Ah, but you are wrong. :P (I'm actually 100% positive nobody here belives what I believe about music)

I am representing the King of kings and Lord of lords. – Agree.

The Deuteronomy 22:5 reference (woman shall not wear what a man wears, and vice versa) – After reading up and thinking about this some (I’ve thought about it many times before), I think this verse refers strictly to crossdressing, or wearing garments that were made for the other gender. Notice the second statement, ‘neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment’. Men and women both wore long flowing garments (David cut off part of Saul’s robe and I assure you that he did not cut off part of Saul’s Carhartt precursors. Jesus wore a robe.); yes, there were differences in how they were put together, and what they were made of, and styles (just like there are different styles of dresses e.g. jumper vs ball gown), but they did have different appearances. Even so, today, men’s jeans and women’s jeans look different (I think the difference is mainly tightness – please let me know if I’m missing anything. I’m not a women’s clothing expert); men and women’s shirts look different; men and women’s shoes look different; men and women’s jackets look different. (Except for the unisex stuff, and I’m currently unsure of how to address that). Most of the women I’ve seen who wear pants wear tight ones, and most of the guys who I see do not wear tight pants. We both wear pants, just like back then they both wore robe-thingies, but there is a difference. I know that in some cases. I have seen women wearing more masculine pants and men wearing tighter pants (Idk why they do it, it’s rather disgusting). And then there’s the whole army thing where everyone is equal…? Perhaps you could throw this into the reasons why women shouldn’t be in the army – they wear the same clothes. (That’s what it looks like to me, please correct if wrong) But I do not think this verse is a legitimate argument against pants.

The 1 Timothy 2:9-10 reference (women adorn themselves in modest apparel) – Interesting point on ‘katastole’; I’ve seen counter-arguments saying that back in that time pretty much all apparel was in that category. But I’m going to focus on the ‘modest’ part. Since there is such a thing as modest apparel, there must be such a thing as immodest apparel. Why would Paul tell the women to wear modest apparel if all apparel was modest? The Bible does have something to say about dress! And it says that the dress should be modest! (What does modest mean, anyhow?) Wikipedia says that “modesty, sometimes known as demureness, is a mode of dress and deportment which intends to avoid the encouraging of sexual attraction in others.” Another angle on the word: someone who is modest doesn’t talk about their achievements/abilities. So if modest clothing avoids provoking sexual attraction in others, and it doesn’t throw the focus on certain parts of your body, then immodest clothing provokes sexual attraction and throws the focus on certain parts of your body. You know what they are. Pretty much any clothing that shows a lot of skin would then be considered immodest; any clothing that clings would then be considered immodest; and even clothing that may not reveal but has potential to reveal/cling if you were to bend over, etc. would probably be something to avoid. Pants, and especially tight ones, can draw attention to places. For this reason, I would not consider pants to be modest attire for women.

When you are dressed differently than everybody else, people want to know why – Agree. And I revised my thoughts on this so many times I finally just gave up because they wouldn’t come out right.

Anyhow, those are my thoughts on statements that those of you that replied made. Your eyes are probably tired, your legs cramped from sitting so long, and you probably are getting hungry by now. Hang in there, I’m almost finished. Got a few more random things (:

One thing to consider when you are picking out your wardrobe: men are visual. And they are attracted to females, or the human race would have been gone long ago. It’s hard to explain this to girls, because guys and girls are wired so differently (and that’s how God made us). And though men do have the responsibility to control where their eyes look, and what they think on, it sure helps when the girls are understanding and wear clothes that don’t show off their shape (whether by showing skin or clinging to it).

Here’s an interesting thing. I would get into debates with people about this (I am pretty passionate about the issue too), and some people would tell me (after I told them this), “But there are modest pants that are loose and don’t outline things!” Well, if those tight pants you are wearing are immodest and you have the option of wearing ‘modest’ loose pants, why aren’t you wearing them? Seems like they contradicted themselves…

I said that I don’t think women should wear pants, but that doesn’t mean that I think all skirts are good. There are modest skirts and immodest skirts, and I already talked about what modest and immodest mean above. Personally, I think the most modest are dresses because you can have the skirt part hanging from the shirt part and you don't have to have elastic around the waist. Something like these:

Which you can be somewhat agile in:

Because of the ruffle-thingies on the skirt part, it doesn't have the same outline that a regular flat design would. I have never had a problem when I'm around people that dress like this, and these aren't those clothes that cover up every part of you except for your eyes.

I think I'm going to have to stop there. Thank you all for sharing your thoughts and I hope this helps explain mine!